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Nijesu u pravu. Massa se ugasio poslije otvaranja glave,a i ovaj start sezone ne mora nista da znaci, posto je momak poznat kao vozac koji ne umije da vozi po kisi, isto kao i Raikkonen. Zato su Shumi,Alonso i Vettel u neprevazidjeni.Quote:
Originally Posted by NSX
pa na prvoj trci nije bilo kise, prosle sezone takodje nije bilo kisnih trka..poenta je u tome da je zadnje 3-4 godine dosta teze vozit auto nego prije, prije je prijanjanje bilo mnogo bolje i gume su duze trajale dovoljno je bilo poklopit gas i popamtit tacke kocenja..tu je Massa bio neprevazidjen kad krene sa pol pozicije :)
Prosle godine je bilo dosta kisnih trka.
Ajmo malo mehanike.... Na ovom forumu definitivno fali tehnickih detalja, ali sem Fabie i Masse niko to ne postuje...
Glavna tema ove godine, PUSH vs PULL rod...
PUSH ROD izgleda ovako, to vjerovatno vecina zna..
""Most teams use a push-rod suspension system similar to that shown in the first illustration at the front of their cars.
The suspension arm, coloured blue, connects from the lower part of the wheel upright to a rocker located in the top-part of the chassis. The rocker connects the push-rod to a torsion bar and damper which manages ‘bump’ – i.e. the up and down movement of a wheel. The torsion bar is basically a spring but is twisted rather than compressed.
In addition there is an anti-roll bar which links the suspension across the chassis to control the degree of roll. This redistributes weight to the inside tyre, which helps traction. If you make the bar too stiff then when one wheel goes into bump the other follows and the car feels very unstable.
The final components are the inerter and heave spring. The heave spring manages vertical movement – i.e., when both wheels rise or fall together. Lastly the inter is a very subtle component and is tuned to the natural frequency of the tyres and translates the oscillating motion of the rubber into rotational energy – it is a spinning mass on a threaded bar – again to improve traction.
Of course, not all the bump absorption takes place in the suspension: Wheel rubber flex accounts for around 30% of this total movement in an F1 car.""
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/wp-conten...on-886x615.gif
A PULL rod
""The next illustration shows a pull-rod set-up. The components and function are the same.
There are two differences: the suspension arm is connected from the top of the upright to the bottom of the chassis, and the internal components are lower in the chassis.
This set-up has two advantages over the push-rod. By placing the suspension components closer to the ground the centre of gravity is lower. Also the suspension arm is better able to condition airflow from the front wing towards the sidepod so in theory there is a small aerodynamic gain.
However, the chassis shape is constrained by FIA guidelines so the aero gain is not as great as it is when pull-rod suspension is used at the rear of the car.
There are two main disadvantages to front pull-rod suspension. One is that the the upper wishbone must transmit more load, some of which would otherwise have been carried by the push-rod. This means the chassis and wishbone needs to be strengthened – see the yellow circle. This adds weight and negates somewhat the CoG gain.
The second disadvantage is it takes longer tune a pull-rod. This is important given the limited testing time in F1 today. Teams need to rapidly tune spring and damper settings and if the components are hidden away this is trickier and potentially reduces valuable track time.""
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/wp-conten...sp-886x617.gif
Pa kad uporedite....
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/wp-conten...suspension.gif
By connecting the push-rod to the wheel upright the driver can use steering angle to affect the suspension. Under steering the natural movement of the push-rod reduce load transfer across the chassis and effectively allows a softer set-up.
The opposite happens with a front pull-rod so it is connected to the wishbone rather than the upright to counter this effect. Hence all else being equal you need to run a stiffer suspension set-up which compromises mechanical grip.
In short, Anderson’s assertion is that the pull-rod also has mechanical compromises that more than offset the (small) aero gains.
Without having access to a dynamo data and proper car models, quantifying the effect is difficult. But the logic appears sound. There is no doubt that when Red Bull introduced the rear pull-rod with success teams will have evaluated a front pull-rod set-up as well. That only one team has adopted it suggests if there is a gain it likely is not worth the hassle.
What’s next for Ferrari?
Will Ferrari make the switch back to push-rod this year? Personally I don’t think so as it would be a massive admission of failure and the gain either way is minimal.
More likely is a switch back to push-rod for the 2013 car, unless the aero gains become more apparent in the re-design. Ferrari’s win in Malaysia makes things a little more interesting as the supposed mechanically disadvantaged pull-rod should not in theory yield benefit on a slippery surface.
However, the story of Ferrari’s victory (notwithstanding the tremendous efforts of Fernando Alonso) is in its ability to switch on the tyres in damp conditions better that its competitors, something which the Sauber appears even more adept at.
Their decision may be influenced by a desire to accommodate a Mercedes-style DRS-activated F-duct. Or that might serve as a useful excuse for abandoning the pull-rod set-up at the front of the car.
Ferrari are pinning their hopes on their May upgrade. Even if the updated packages works the Scuderia will struggle to catch up with McLaren and Red Bull as those teams have three months of experience in optimising the 2012 package and Ferrari will be starting from scratch.
Already the scene is set for a fascinating three days of testing in Ferrari’s backyard at Mugello in two months’ time.
Rekao sam ja odmah, Ferrari se zajebao sa vjesanjem i cao.
I tako je.
Oce oni da ispanu pametniji od ostalih.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fabia_Elegance!
Tako je E_K_V ;)
A sreća pa su pojedini ovih godina sve pogađali. Očekujem isti % pogodaka i ove godine.
Sjecam se te trke jer sam je gledao uzivo (moja prva live F1 trka).Quote:
Originally Posted by M.S.
Nije tacno da Ralf nije vozio... vozio je i on i zavrsio 4.
Onda sam nesto permutovao...
Inace,steta sto nema vise Imole,A1 ringa,starog Hockenheim-a,sto se F1 ne vozi na Nordslaife itd,itd.
Znam da su neke uske za preticanje bolida sa danasnjim performansama,neke imaju male zone izlijetanja itd,itd,ali su bile oldschool i imale su mnogo vise harizme nego ove danasnje po Kini,Indiji itd,itd...
stara skola, tj stre staze...svaka je neuporedivo bolja od ovih sad tipa valensija, singapur i slicne "gradske staze"...nema mi nista mucnije nego gledat tako nesto...dosa je bio Monako, a sad ihi ma jos nekoliko...
zna se sto su staze, imola, spa, a1, monza, stari hokenhajm ,nirburgring, manjikur, montreal....
Imola... Austrija... bas mi je zao onih staza, bile du fenomenalne.
Citav F1 sport ide nizbrdo, i samo pare rade.
Niti ima vise bolida kao ranije, ovi sad izgledaju presmijesno, niti ima dobrih staza i trka kao ranije.
Uh samo da oce za prvo vrijeme izbacit Valensiju, Singu i Monako, bio bih zadovoljan.
The real problem with the F2012, a problem Ferrari cannot openly admit, is the ban of reactive suspensions (Lotus style). Ferrari's were even more radical than the Lotus, as they inter-connected also the front and the rear wheels and the left and right sides. This explains why the car behaves well with heavy loads and why it ceases to be effective under light loads; such a system would allow to maintain a stable height, and even more important, would improve the balance under braking, in pure traction exits and in slow curves. As Ferrari was not allowed to put it on the car, the rest of the car suffers, as everything was designed for that device.
The starting point of the exhaust system, pointing towards the wings of the rear brakes (that never had been so complex in a Ferrari car) would work with that device, but when the system was stripped from the car, all the original exhaust system did was to increase the instability that the device would have prevented. When it is said that there is a team in Maranello that is working on the initial exhaust solution, I think that what they are trying to do is develop such suspension device, but in a way that the FIA may not ban; meanwhile there is another team that is working on a new location for the exahusts (as the McLaren one, etc), and for that alternative location, it will be necessary to modify the sidepods and the engine cap, removing the "Acer Duct". If the first team is successful, the car will be a blast; if it is not, and the second alternative is used, the car may only be abreast of rivals, but not above them.
The ban of reactive suspensions by the FIA has resulted in a bigger loss for Ferrari than for Renault or for any of the other teams in the championship. This explanation is twofold; on the one hand that of Ferrari went beyond, as it interconnected the front and the rear wheels and the left and right sides, while the Lotus Renault solution was limited to prevent the pitch (or change in pitch) under braking and acceleration.
On the other hand the Ferrari is much more "pitch sensitive" than the Renault or any rivals who had plans to use such devices, because of its wide and very fine nose, that does not have an overhung, almost like a horizontal spoiler, different to any other nose used by the teams on the Championship, which are narrower, thicker and extending ahead of the pillars. The Ferrari is thereby subject to pressures from the nose, as when you get your hand out of the window of a car and put it horizontally: a little tilting is all it takes to displace it. When the Ferrari slows down, the nose tends to fall, and that gives more downforce in the front, but at the same time, it removes downforce from the rear and it, therefore, makes the car less stable under braking than the engineers had hoped when they designed it with the reactive suspension that initially the FIA did not declare illegal (which was why it was initially developed by several teams); later, coming out from a slow curve, the nose rises and reduces the downforce in the front, increasing it in the rear; that should be good for traction, but the traction lost at the front means that the improved traction may not be fully used, as the car would oversteer, forcing drivers to get out of slow corners with more restraint than necessary.
The woes of Ferrari begun due to the absence of a device designed to improve the balance, and due to the flawed aerodynamics of the car, that were planned for being used with that device.
ja ne brinem za Massu (naseg)...jer vozaci dolaze i odlaze tj prolaze :D a Ferrari je uvijek tu
http://ilariaf1blog.files.wordpress....errari_504.jpg
http://f1racing.com.hr/formula-1/velika-nagrada-francuske-vraca-se-na-paul-ricard
belgija napolje...niposto ako mogu da je organizuju...
valensija...slobodno...greota je da propada jedan vikend zbog onakve staze...
Nadjoh neki stari citat i ne mogu da vjerujem :nevreness:Quote:
Originally Posted by Fabia_Elegance!
Spa je dobra.
Nove staze osim Turke ne valjaju nista.
Valencia out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by M.S.
Sto je tu cudno?
Valencia out, Monaco mora da ostane ipak je kultna staza a i ne valja da sve staze budu siroke, Singapur je nocna trka pa je OK i to da vidimo..mada bi mogli malo izmijenit konfiguraciju staze
E da, Monaco out.
Ja ne gledam F1 zbog "legendarnih" staza.
P.S. zbog cega je ona legendarna?
zbog mnogo cega, a izmedju ostalog i zbog toga sto je najteza za voznju cak i sa svim prepravkama..mala greska i u zid, meni je veci merak da gledam milimetarski preciznu voznju bez preticanja nego 20 vjestackih preticanja sa DRSom i KERSom na stazama sirokim 15 metara..
Onda si ti jedinac.Quote:
Originally Posted by NSX
Staza je kanta, F1 je sport brzine i manevara, a onamo se svodi na uzaludno kruzenje, sminkerisanje svjetskog dzet seta, i na taktike sa pit stopom.
Monaco OUT !!!!
on makar nije isao da krka mesine dok se najveci mucio u sredini kolone nego je ostao da ga podrzi :p
ma monako neka stoji...bio je tu vazda..neka je idalje..al neka batale ovaj trend gradskih staza.... to je uzas za gledanje...
pih sto ne ostade Mistral citav nego stavise tu sikanu :D
Ipak sam uspio stici na sami kraj trke.:tongue:Quote:
Originally Posted by NSX
Nego, strucnjace, pogledaj ovo http://www.formula1onlive.com/2012/0...ision-was.html :applouse:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Petronas
Rekao sam ja to, ali...
Quote:
Originally Posted by NSX
mnogo dobra staza ovako sa slika... pocetni pravac...brza sikana...pa jos malo pravca...idealno za preticanja... pa onda mistral straight iz dva dijela... a svidjaju m ise i ove krivine 7, 8 i 9...
World champion passed Karthikeyan on the back straight at the Sepang track but the two collided as the Indian moved back towards the racing line.Quote:
Originally Posted by Petronas
kako je iz ovoga kriv Vettel? Znaci ovaj ga je isjekao kad je ovaj prosao sa 99% bolida...vozaci koji se zaobilaze za cijeli krug na stazi nemaju bas nikakva prava u odnosu na vodece, tako je pravilima utvrdjeno i NK je kaznjen po pravilima, Vettel jeste "kriv" na isti nacin kao i Button sto nije razmisljao da krece u obilazenje kante i trebao je da bude oprezniji jer je trebao da ima na umu da ce cigo mozda napravit neku kretensku stvar..ali su i on i Button dovoljno "kaznjeni" sto su izgubili znacajne bodove, HRTovi su opasni na stazi i kraj price, pogotovo kad ih voze "cucumberi" :)
Ja ne mogu da vjerujem sta pricas ..Quote:
Originally Posted by NSX
Pa vidis li da mu se Narain potpuno sklonio sa idealne putanje i pustio ga da prodje, a onda ovaj neiskusni zutalj zauzeo citavu stazu i po izlasku iz krivine direktno se prestrojava u Narainovu putanju ???
Jedini nacin da izbjegne i ovo je bilo da ode na travu, a to nije duzan.
Evo i Crnjo radi nesto korisno.
Svaka cast za svaku ovakvu akciju.
http://thef1times.com/community/display/00547
http://thef1times.com/images/548435_...0298872_n.jpeg
mi nismo gledali isti snimak izgleda..pauziraj pola sekunde prije kontakta i onda pauziraj na kontakt, NK je bio van idealne putanje i onda se vracao na idealnu putanju i zakacio Vettela koji je skoro vec bio prosao, mislim znate obojica da bas i ne podnosim Njemca(zbog ponasanja i zbog onoga u Turskoj ponajvise) i sigurno ga ne bih branio da je bio kriv..Quote:
Originally Posted by Petronas
Sad nesto "kopam" po ormanu i nadjoh par zanimljivih "stvarcica"...
Za brata Fabiu jedna "navijacka" slika:
Attachment 84940
kako se massa napalio na alonsa, a na svaku sledecu trku ce da ga deru kao repu.:lolblue:
Evo jos jedan za Naraina... NSX, urazumi se.
http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/2...eyan-incident/
Dobro dosa MURIĆANE.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rajko_Murovic
nema sto da se urazumim, postoji video i postoje pisana pravila :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Petronas
“Karthikeyan didn’t do anything unnecessary - didn’t hit him, didn’t change direction sharply. Sebastian overtook him and started to turn. But Narain was going straight.”
izgleda i Petrov nije gledao isti snimak :)